Rumoured: SIA goes nonstop SIN-YYZ

[sqforever]

Found this on Cathaytalk: http://www.cathaytalk.com/showthread...5334#post25334

This guy found this out through members of SQ's marketing team and says it is a result of the new Canadian air agreements. He says the Boeing 777-200LR will be ordered and outfitted like the B77W. SIA says that Toronto is under-served by Asian carriers and there is a growing demand for travel to Southeast Asia from this city. he doesn't mention this, but I wonder if that means nonstop to YVR will be commenced also? This route should start around late 08/early 09.

[Singapore_Air]

Yes, I just read that too and you beat me to posting it here!

Very interesting. At first on reading the title I was very sceptical.

However, the rest of the content of that user's post is commensurate with SIA Canada's thinking.

If it is true, it's would be a massive turnaround in SIA's attitude to the B77L and a long-overdue welcome for those wishing to fly in comfort between Toronto and South East Asia / India on board Singapore Airlines.

2008/2009 is quite soon too. Maybe our friend Zvezda or someone has some guidance information with regards to B77L production slots in Seattle?

[LionCity]

You folks are really in tune with the developments. Glad to have updates like these. Yes, will be good to have direct flights to Canada from Sin. When do you think this will happen?

[9V-SPL]

Oh! Please let this happen!! Does this affect the A345s? If they go ahead with this plan?

[sqforever]

You folks are really in tune with the developments. Glad to have updates like these. Yes, will be good to have direct flights to Canada from Sin. When do you think this will happen?

As said in my first post, it should be late 2008-early 2009. This is def. good in light of CX's recent frequency increase to YYZ.

Oh! Please let this happen!! Does this affect the A345s? If they go ahead with this plan?

I'm really not sure whether this will affect the A345s but I doubt it. As said in the other threads, it is rumoured that the A345 will be converted to all J. If that happens, the a/c type will probrably be dedicated to the business market with all J and the 77Ls will serve the nonstop routes that have a market for Y. I'm guessing that the A345 will be refurbished and kept on LAX and EWR. I think SIA should use the 77L for YYZ, SFO, and IAH (Houston not only would be good for oil execs but there is a growing Asian, and especially Singaporean community which would justify Y class for the flight). YVR can wait until the dreamliner arrives especially if some/all of them come in a 2-class config. as Vancouver has literally no F market.

[zvezda]

Maybe our friend Zvezda or someone has some guidance information with regards to B77L production slots in Seattle?

Unless Boeing increase 777 production rates again (which I don't expect), there are no 2008 or 2009 delivery slots available. It's very, very late to try to convert the last few 777-300ERs on order into 777-200LRs. Boeing would command a king's ransom for that this late in the game and SQ wouldn't pay it.

The only realistic chance I see is if SQ's 13 options for 777-300ERs are tied to production slots. Those could be converted to 777-200LRs for a reasonable price because SQ have the leverage. Even if that were to happen, it wouldn't be in 2008 or early 2009.

This whole rumor sounds to me like nothing more than wishful thinking.

[flyboy777]

I reckon SQ are bound to order B77Ls if they have a case enough for it. There is obviously demand to South East Asia from Toronto. If they do order some, I reckon they will replace the A345s, they will be used to expand the North American routes (YYZ, SFO, IAH (non-stop), ORD?). Maybe later they'll add more secondary cities like SEA, YVR, DEN etc. with A350s/B787s. But I ask the question. Why know? SQ had options for a further 5 A345s. Why didn't they exercise those a while back?

[MAN Flyer]

I reckon SQ are bound to order B77Ls if they have a case enough for it. There is obviously demand to South East Asia from Toronto. If they do order some, I reckon they will replace the A345s, they will be used to expand the North American routes (YYZ, SFO, IAH (non-stop), ORD?). Maybe later they'll add more secondary cities like SEA, YVR, DEN etc. with A350s/B787s. But I ask the question. Why know? SQ had options for a further 5 A345s. Why didn't they exercise those a while back?

[flyguy]

seen a report on SQ CEO who mentioned that the 777LR deal is up to Boeing's CEO to go through - but Boeing need to take back SQ's 5 A345s - which is a sticking point for Boeing.

[Singapore_Air]

Interesting flyguy. Where did you see that? Definitely interesting. Not too sure if Boeing will want the A345s though.

[LionCity]

Interesting flyguy. Where did you see that? Definitely interesting. Not too sure if Boeing will want the A345s though.

I assumed that the cost per seat-mile for the A345 is higher than the 777LR and is this correct?

[sqforever]

The guy from Cathay Talk received more information from SQ Canada. Here is an idea of the schedule SIA could use:

Outbound:
SQ24 LV: SIN 01:15 Nonstop
AR: YYZ 06:00
EQP: 77L Time: 17hr 45min

Return:
SQ23 LV: YYZ 09:30 Nonstop
AR: SIN 16:20+1
EQP: 77L Time: 17hr 50min

[milehighj]

They have flight nos. and flight timings for aircraft not yet even on firm order??

[sqforever]

They have flight nos. and flight timings for aircraft not yet even on firm order??

Well I guess thats SIA just trying to be prepared or something like that. Or maybe airlines work these things out before buying new aircraft? Either way, the interest in the 772LR just seems to go forward. I really hope that this deal works out and SQ can expand the nonstop services in N. America. Almost like how the Celestars were phased out quickly with the arrival of the 777, Boeing is once again stealing SIA away from the A340.

[zvezda]

I reckon SQ are bound to order B77Ls if they have a case enough for it. There is obviously demand to South East Asia from Toronto. If they do order some, I reckon they will replace the A345s, they will be used to expand the North American routes (YYZ, SFO, IAH (non-stop), ORD?). Maybe later they'll add more secondary cities like SEA, YVR, DEN etc. with A350s/B787s. But I ask the question. Why know? SQ had options for a further 5 A345s. Why didn't they exercise those a while back?

Not only did SQ not exercise their A340-500 options, they cancelled them before they expired.

I assumed that the cost per seat-mile for the A345 is higher than the 777LR and is this correct?

Correct.

The guy from Cathay Talk received more information from SQ Canada. Here is an idea of the schedule SIA could use:

Outbound:
SQ24 LV: SIN 01:15 Nonstop
AR: YYZ 06:00
EQP: 77L Time: 17hr 45min

Return:
SQ23 LV: YYZ 09:30 Nonstop
AR: SIN 16:20+1
EQP: 77L Time: 17hr 50min

That's not a plausible schedule for two reasons. First, the flight times for SIN-YVR in a 777 would be two to two and a half hours less than for SIN-LAX in an A340. Second, YVR-SIN would be at least half an hour longer than SIN-YVR.

What everyone seems to be overlooking is that the 777-200ER has sufficient range for the route, though it would occasionally be load restricted westbound. The 777-200LR would give SQ the ability to carry a lot of cargo on the route.